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TRUTH BE TOLD-1349420

Articles Posted: 49  Links Seeded: 14
Member Since: 9/2009  Last Seen: 5/16/2012

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Forgiveness

Wed Jul 28, 2010 4:00 PM EDT
education, people, forgiveness, advices, offenses, frienship
By Truth be told-1349420
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Forgiveness.

It can be a sign of wisdom and moral strength in both he who begs for it and he who grants it. But be aware that the seeker may not be as sincere as the grantor. The fact that someone asks for forgiveness doesn’t really mean he/she craves for it. It is absolutely important to engage only your brain and not your heart when it comes to forgive someone that has hurt you. The heart is emotionally weak and may fall for any bogus apology which may expose you to more severe damage. In this case, forgiveness can be a suicidal act of naiveté. But the brain will use its supply of wisdom and intelligence to guide you through. Ask, what am I losing or gaining if I accept or reject the apology? And, know that accepting an apology may make you look wiser, and rejecting it may make you look wilder. And it sometimes might be the other way around. It all depends on the nature of the offense and the value of the friendship you are to protect. One thing you know for sure is that this person is the offensive kind. Should you give him/her another opportunity to hurt you more? Only your brain, but not your heart can respond to that.

Remember, there is this saying “Fool me once, shame one you; fool me twice shame on me”
After one has offended someone and his/her action was made public, he/she may seek forgiveness from the offended party for the sole selfish purpose to cleanse his/her name and/ or image from critics, but without really feeling sorry for his/her deed. Or he/she may only be apologizing in order to recuperate opportunities that his/her rudeness may have caused him/her to miss; or to discourage any intention of retaliation. If he/she has come on his/her own to apologize recognizing his/her vile act without being motivated by the impact of critics, it would be easier and safer for one to decide if he/she is worthy of forgiveness. This is why, you, the offended one, must be cautious at forgiving someone. You need to not only feel, but also see that the person is truly sorry for his/her act. Don’t let a soft voice and/or sad face and powerful pity-evoking words dupe you into forgiving someone that may be only acting maliciously to regain your friendship to better hurt you.

Usually, offenses take place in the middle of a friendship when there has been some bond established that has become hard to break due to attachment and memories of good times and secrets shared. It might be more difficult to withhold on forgiveness. This is where the heart may override the brain’s advices. But offenses that occur at the genesis of a friendship that was yet to germinate are worth being thoroughly evaluated to safely determine their merit for forgiveness. Now don’t get me wrong, it is always a good thing to forgive. But when you are willing and ready to forgive, you must protect yourself and cancel all possibilities for another friendly bite. This is to say that in your kindness, you may accept an offender’s apology only to relieve him/her from the torture of a guilty conscience or critics, but not to allow him/her back into your heart or life to finish what he/she has started unless you intend to retaliate. But oftentimes when you think you are going to retaliate, you may end up getting hurt again worse.

When it comes to forgive an offense, it remains a question of how bad you were hurt. There are offenses that leave a scar in your heart; there are offenses that leave a scar in your brain, and offenses that leave a scar on your body. Each of these different types of offenses requires different level of understanding and spiritual strength to forgive. Some of them, only the passing of time can heal and make forgive. Some gets healed, but you remain sore and you can still feel the pain, every time you see your offender, or hear his/her name. But you know that you have forgiven your offender, only when his/her presence or the flash back of his/her offense creates no feeling of resentment in you. As long as you are in pain, you may not be ready to forgive, although the spirit of retaliation may have died long ago.

If someone has hurt you in private and the pain has caused you to make his/her action public, I suggest that if said individual comes ask for your forgiveness, you demand that he/she apologize to you in public so that you can be somehow convinced of his/her sincerity if he/she accepts to do so; and that should he/she hurt you again, the shame will still be on him/her. But should he/she hesitate to do as you ask, this is a sign that he/she may not be ready or willing to be forgiven and that his/her reason for seeking your forgiveness may be highly self-centered. Still, it all depends on what you think you have got to lose or gain.

I dedicate this article to all of you, fellow viners and vine friends who may have been offended by a relative, friend, or stranger with whom you have or “had to start” a friendship and you are facing the hard decision of accepting or rejecting a request for forgiveness. Forgiveness isn’t something you just shower someone with upon request, but which must be administered slowly and gradually like a medicine. Remember, the decision is yours and so will be the side effects. I wish you all wisdom and happiness in your lives.

Peacefully and lovingly yours
Truth to told.

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Truth be told-1349420

Forgiveness isn’t something you just shower someone with upon request, but which must be administered slowly and gradually like a medicine. I invite you all to share your views with regard to CoH. Thanks for your participation if any. Peace.

  • 4 votes
Reply#1 - Wed Jul 28, 2010 4:12 PM EDT
Dowser

Don't forget that some people truly are sorry and didn't realize the hurt it caused at the time... I say, forgive, if you can, but be leery of future transgressions. Someone may be truly sorry, but can't help themselves, too.

Forgiveness heals your own heart. If you can let something go-- not forget it, but let the hurt go, it will affect you less in the long run.

IMHO, of course.

  • 9 votes
Reply#2 - Wed Jul 28, 2010 5:38 PM EDT
Truth be told-1349420

Yes Dowser, dear, you are right and I'm aware of it. This is why I say some apologize just to get rid of their guilty conscience. But how far are they willing to go to proof they are really sincere in their remorse. If you put them to a test such as a publicly made apology, you may find out better if they are really sorry rather than taking a soft voice, sad face, and hypocritical words for it. Like I said, it all depends on the nature of the offense and the value of the friendship you are to protect. You are the one that is offended, you don't want an hypocritical apology to cause further harm to you. Do you? If someone hurts me, I would have prefered that he or she makes me forget about it rather than passing time.Thanks my dear friend, for your opinion. Peace.

  • 2 votes
#2.1 - Wed Jul 28, 2010 5:52 PM EDT
Dowser

I understand what you are saying-- But, here's an example. My mother says things to me sometimes that are truly unforgivable. She means them at the time. But, with a little thought, she is sorry that she said it, and will apologize. I know, without a shadow of a doubt that it will happen again. I know that the hurtful things she says, she means, absolutely, and at that precise moment. But I also know that she really doesn't feel that way in her heart-- she is just mad. And, I know, without a shadow of a doubt, that she has a mental illness that she can not help.

So, do I not forgive her and feel bad about not forgiving someone who likely can't help themselves? Or do I forgive her, brace for the next one, ignore it when it does happen, and go happily and peacefully with my life-- allowing myself to love her, despite her madness? I opt for the forgiveness. The only person my lack of forgiveness hurts is me-- she could care less, she is in the grip of madness. Yet, she is my mother, and I love her. I just pay no attention to her when she gets like that.

I hope that makes some sense...

  • 5 votes
#2.2 - Wed Jul 28, 2010 9:27 PM EDT
Truth be told-1349420

Makes perfect sense. And this is also why I said and I quote "It all depends on the nature of the offense and the value of the friendship you are to protect." I wouldn't include loved ones and closed family members in this situation for these individuals requires unconditional love, tolerance and acceptance. Let's us focus our attention more on friends, distant relatives , and strangers. There is no offense I wouldn't forgive to my parents, siblings, and offsprings, and I wished I could say the same about spouses, concubines, and such. It depends on which part of yourself is attacked. I once again appreciate your opinion, my dear. Thanks. Peace.

  • 2 votes
#2.3 - Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:17 PM EDT
Dowser

You have a wonderful day today, also! Take care--

  • 2 votes
#2.4 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 11:47 AM EDT
Soosalah

TBT,

I'm curious as to why you wrote this opinion. Are you a professional counselor, or are your beliefs regarding forgiveness, merely from your own experiences?

Just curious.

Oh, one more thing. I have to say I don't agree with you at all regarding forgiveness and family members. To say we are to love and forgive, or overlook their misdeeds, I can not agree with that.

  • 4 votes
#2.5 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 7:21 PM EDT
Truth be told-1349420

Thanks Soosalah for coming by. First, dear, allow me to advance that there is no better professional than the one with tangible experiences in a domain in question. It can be personal or observed experiences supplemented by academic studies. However, nothing can be more accurate than what you actually have experienced in your own life pertaining to a certain issue. A licensed professional is trained to assume what can be the most appropriate treatment to a certain disorder while you, the patient, know the real symptom, and it may be you to tell the professional which of the many medicines he/she prescribed you actually cures your pain. Do I make sense so far?

Now, I do not disagree that you don't agree with me regarding forgiveness and family members. But I certainly have not said that one is to love and forgive and overlook their family members's misdeeds. I simply responded to Dowser"s post @ 2.2 about her mom. For me personally, I say that there is no offenses I wouldn't forgive to my loved ones, parents, siblings ect. but I am not urging anyone to do the same if they feel theirs do not deserve to be forgiven all offenses. I spoke in quality of the relationship between me and my family members. I speak only for myself and not even for any of my family members. This is why I was cautious to say in the article that "It all depends on the nature of the offense and the value of the friendship you are to protect." ( paragraph 1) This also includes frienship between one and his/her family members. No one can tell you who to forgive and who not to forgive. It's your decision. Got it now? Sorry, if I failed to be clear enough to you.

I appreciate your stopping by; and your comment is precious to me. Thanks and Peace.

  • 4 votes
#2.6 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 8:47 PM EDT
Reply
US Citizen-658112

I will limit this to friends and exclude from it marriage so that I might reduce my normally long responses by several paragraphs...

I think a key thing is to realize that forgiveness is a separate thing from forgetting something, and altogether separate again from trusting someone at least in the particular thing that they wronged you on such that they could wrong you again in the same way in the future.

Forgiveness - I am coming to realize over time - as much a "giver" thing as it is a "receiver" thing. There is NO chance really that the wrong can ever be righted if forgiveness does not occur.

I have had a number of real-life "friends" whose friendship for me was really a "service" to them in some way or another...all of the time.

In one case, one such friend became notorious for getting me involved in planning something he wanted to do, but knew I was not interested in, only later to let me know I was "paying half" for some big outdoor adventure. He then got miffed after "all that planning" when I declined to further participate..." After a number of round of this kind of thing.....we are no longer "friends".....

In another case, a "friend" asked to to go along on an off-season deer hunt (far too big a herd, special permits...etc....), and made sure I took my deer rifle along...although I was NOT interested in hunting (had given it up really before that time...). I was shocked when - upon arriving - he "forgot" his own deer rifle...had to "borrow" mine....which he had apparently been coveting for some reason.... So I handed it to him, he stood there and took a deer with it...and all it cost him was my trust and friendship....hope it was worth it to him.... This after a long string of various kinds of "trust issues" with this long-term "friend".....

So, for me, I have long had my own trust abused by others who notice I live within my means, and don't live "from check to check", and somehow get the idea that means I'm interested in taking on their financial mismanagement, and paying for their adventures, etc........

I've long ago developed a "thick skin" when it comes to financial manipulation being directed at me....as I do not wish to go bankrupt or have financial problems just because someone else can't handle their own finances. There are loans, counselors, and public resources out there for these irresponsible "friends" to turn to...what I have to offer people is friendship....NOT financial products......

Friendships involve attention and funding, I know this. I just much prefer the pretty much "pay your own way" method so the friendship remains on a personal level, and does not become a finanancial transaction.

So I would say try to forgive them, even if it's after the fact and the friendship is over, as to do anything else is to let it fester in your own gut too, and they probably won't even care if they knew, because of the kind of people they really are, and are not, at heart.

I hope this all makes some kind of sense to readers.....

  • 5 votes
Reply#3 - Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:23 PM EDT
Truth be told-1349420

There is NO chance really that the wrong can ever be righted if forgiveness does not occur.

I thank you much US Citizen for taking the time to elaborate so effectively using personal experiences to define friendship with respect to forgiveness. Your account and approach do make sense. You seem to know how to handle friends that run parallel to a one-way street.
Yes, I agree with your above quoted statement; I'm not against forgiveness, but I advise forgivers to be extra careful to not be hurt again by the same person twice. The offender has a lot to gain, and the offended has a lot to lose. Sometime when you forgive someone, you may be giving him/her the opportunity to make up for their wrong, but oftentimes, they repeat their offenses. It so happens that you may have helped him/her better to change if you did not forgive him/her. After he/she loses your precious friendship, he or she will learn his/her lesson and won't hurt and lose the next friend he/she will have. Thanks again. Peace.

  • 4 votes
#3.1 - Wed Jul 28, 2010 8:40 PM EDT
Reply
Elaine-1503791

I think we have no choice but to forgive, for our own mental health. By not forgiving, the offender holds a certain power over our well being and they don't deserve that kind of power.

When we do not forgive, the offense is settled. ie. You have hurt me and I don't forgive you. By not forgiving, you have taken away the universe's right to settle the matter. You settle it yourself by holding an unforgiving grudge.

When you forgive, the offense remains un-resolved, and is left to the law of life to settle it.

If I were to hurt people, it would be better for me if they refused to forgive me. Then I win, I offended them, they are hurt and I have successfully marked their soul. But if they forgive me, their soul is clean, and I lose because the law of life has a debt to settle with me.....and I have it coming in ways I don't even expect.

US Citizen, that is so true how you described learning lessons about life by how 'friends' treat you. Forgiveness....to me....doesn't mean sticking around for more mistreatment and being used. Letting the hurt go, and letting the person go out of our lives, is a smart thing to do. Live, learn and move on.

Dowser, it is lovely that you forgive your mom and know she isn't well. I find myself doing the same thing with family members who say little insults, and then mask them as 'jokes'. If I take the comments as they are meant, as an insult, they then say 'it was a joke'. We all know 'jokes' are supposed to be 'funny', not hurtful slights. But if I say nothing and just forgive, then I'm not the one left owing a little karmic debt for a hurt I've caused.

We should all be very careful of our thoughts...lest we become them.

As the rest of you have said here......I hope all this makes sense, it is truly how I see life.

  • 8 votes
Reply#4 - Wed Jul 28, 2010 10:07 PM EDT
Dowser

We should all be very careful of our thoughts...lest we become them.

Very very true! :-)

  • 5 votes
#4.1 - Wed Jul 28, 2010 10:09 PM EDT
Truth be told-1349420

Dear Elaine, thanks for your contribution. Everything you have said is logical.
"If I were to hurt people, it would be better for me if they refused to forgive me"
Yes you will feel better because you were sincere in your apology and you try to reach out to the person to settle the matter. But if you were hypocritical in your apology and only trying to regain the person's frienship so that you can continue to use and abuse him/her, you will not fell better if he or she rejects your apology. Just like US Citizen did by cutting them off, they must still miss the privileges and freebies from US Citizen. I'm sure US Citizen has sincerely forgiven them, but for them, it's like US Citizen did not forgive them because He/she did not allow them to continue to abuse his/her goodness. That is why I say and I quote " ...you may accept an offender's apology only to relieve him/her from the torture of a guilty conscience or critics, but not to allow him/her back into your heart or life to finish what he/she has started..."
Therefore, having said that, I seem to invite people to always forgive, but diplomatically. I thank you my friend for your precious opinion. Peace.

  • 3 votes
#4.2 - Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:47 PM EDT
Reply
Kara Shalee

Many wise comments posted above. TbT, I choose the path of forgiveness, unless, as has been pointed out, there is an INTENT of the friend to re-tread using you for financial gain, over and over again. This has happened to us. While we wish the person well in our hearts, we eventually become tired-er as well as broke-er. Then we keep our distance. But we never close the door entirely. Although the Bank is closed, our hearts are not. We always hope for that miracle.

And as for ourselves, have we not ever needed another's forgiveness? While we might be mindful (if we are mentally intact) of re-offending, I think we must all need to be forgiven for something along the road of life...........just my 2 cents. Thank you for your article, Theresa

  • 3 votes
Reply#5 - Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:07 PM EDT
Truth be told-1349420

Thanks Theresa N for stoppingby and dropping your opinion. I, too , my dear, choose the path of forgiveness. But I propose that "when you are willing and ready to forgive, you must protect yourself and cancel all possibilities for another friendly bite." It sometimes happens that we become tired of forgiving someone until he or she leaves you with no choice but to cut him/her off your friendship line. Like you have so well said, we all may need another's forgiveness and it is for that very reason why we are vainly waiting to need another person's forgiveness, for that other person is too busy reaping our forgiveness. Thanks again my dear friend. Peace and love.

  • 3 votes
#5.1 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 12:05 AM EDT
Reply
Hekofawoman

Hi Truth - good article! I have never made a conscious decision to forgive anyone, ever. I have never in my head or heart said to myself....I need to forgive them so I can feel better. What happened for me was "time" stepped in and took over. I never acted out in a hateful way...I usually just left or withdrew. I went through all the stages of what I call grief..cause for me, the end of a relationship is like a death. At least for me...when I end one, it's done. I never worried about forgiving anyone....it just sorta disapeared over time. I have no feelings of anger, sadness, nothing....left and it simply doesn't bother me. I don't dwell on them, think about them or let them (speaking of those) in my life that I never thought I should ever forgive (at least no one else did either. But in the end...with time...I am ambivalent. Forgiving me, that's another story...see I can't get away from me...so I can't forget about me, i live with me.....but I work on it. Hek

  • 4 votes
Reply#6 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 1:25 AM EDT
Vlad's dog

Forgiveness is powerful and works on both sides to make things right again. We all should use this tool more often.

  • 2 votes
Reply#7 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 9:19 AM EDT
SoCAGal

Forgiving me, that's another story...see I can't get away from me...so I can't forget about me, i live with me.....

We are always the hardest on ourselves. Well, most of us anyway. I don't think its true in the case of a narcissist. I hate disappointing or wronging anybody and if I do, I have an extremely hard time forgiving myself and getting past it. I tend to go over it and over it and over it . . . .in my mind until I can see that time has finally passed by long enough to where it doesn't seem to matter anymore. If that makes sense.

That being said. We are all imperfect. We will all make mistakes at one time or another that will require some level of forgiveness. If we are not willing to forgive others, how can we ever expect to be forgiven ourselves when we need it? I speak from a personal stand point here. I still have not forgiven my ex-husband for the emotional hurt he caused me. It's been 9 years since divorcing him. I try, but just can't get past the bitterness I have towards him for what he did to me. I am still in the "get revenge" mode. I want to see him suffer for what he did but that is so wrong of me. I shouldn't be that way. I need to just get past it. Could I ever say that I've forgiven him? I don't know. Can I learn to get past it and finally move on? I hope so.

I am now in a circumstance in which I am hoping for forgiveness for a wrong I have done. How can I ever expect to be forgiven when I can't forgive my ex-husband? Thank you for this post. It has reminded me that forgiveness is a 3-way street. I need to forgive my ex so that I can hope to be forgiven for my wrong doing and then eventually be able to forgive myself.

  • 2 votes
Reply#8 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 10:07 AM EDT
US Citizen-658112

SoCAgal:

May I suggest you begin your forgiveness process by forgiving yourself for not forgiving the narcissist ex-husband who continues to haunt your memories? As your ex-husband is NOT capable of offering forgiveness to you himself due to his totally narcissistic nature, you will be waiting forever to hear "I forgive you" from he who cannot fathom the divine act of forgiveness himself.

As for your current circumstance, the religion I now am associated with outlines a process of repentance from sin that I think offers a good path to the forgiveness you now hope for.

I find this quote to be insightful and hope you will too (I have put what I think is a key quote in bold italic):

"33 And now, as I said unto you before, as ye have had so many awitnesses, therefore, I beseech of you that ye do not bprocrastinate the day of your crepentanceuntil the end; for after this day of life, which is given us to prepare for eternity, behold, if we do not improve our time while in this life, then cometh the dnight of edarkness wherein there can be no labor performed."

The message to me is this: Get the process of repentance started ASAP. If necessary, if your situation is still in process...DO NOT DELAY and instead start the process of repentance which leads in the end to self-forgiveness and forgiveness by others too without waiting for whatever situation you are in to "finish" or "resolve itself". Ecclesiastical leaders or counselors are completely confidential and can assist you even while you may be still in the process of living through whatever it is that is troubling you. The sooner you start to a solution, I predict the sooner you will start feeling better about yourself, and your life.

Here are the steps as I understand them:

1- Confess what troubles you to your ecclesiastical leader (this might be a non-ecclesiastical counselor too...).

2- Feel genuinely sorry about what it is you have done. I have myself inquired into this and been told that "this takes more time than most people realize". So I surmise we are not talking about the "I got caught" or "I'm embarrassed" or the like type of thing, but rather true sorrow for "offending GOD" and also wronging other people and yourself.

3- Ask forgiveness. I take this to mean after the previous steps have been completed that it is necessary to literally ask forgiveness from GOD, from any you have wronged, and then of yourself for yourself.

4- Don't repeat the wrong again. In other words, repentance is NOT to be used as a "reset" between repeated wrongs. To repeat the offense is to become reburdened with the past offenses as well as the present ones...all at once....a circumstance best avoided.....

There is a whole list of scriptural citations to point to to back up this stuff, but I think the point is that by going through this kind of process, one is brought to admit, recognize, think through, and commit to NOT repeating the same thing again in the future.

In the end, the ideal end point is forgiveness from all others who have been wronged by you somehow, and also you forgiving yourself and moving on in life with a "clean conscience".

I hope this makes some sense and is of interest to you. If I need to reword it, or back things up with citations, repost and I'll try again.....

  • 2 votes
#8.1 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 1:54 PM EDT
Truth be told-1349420

SoCagal. Thanks a lot for sharing your thought and experiences pertaining to the issue. I sympathize with you my dear. I also praise US Citizen for the spiritual strength he/she offers you as a solution to your ordeal. I understand your resentment, my dear, but like everyone here says, to forgive is to create solace for the suffering heart, like Elaine states at post #4,
"we have no choice but to forgive, for our own mental health." which seems to mean that the more your think about the offense, the more pain you feel and the eager you become to retaliate which will only put more anger in you and less desire to forgive.

Hekofawoman makes a good point also when she says, "I never worried about forgiving anyone....it just sorta disapeared over time. I have no feelings of anger, sadness, nothing". When you are offended, sometimes, the pain doubles when the offender is someone you did not expect it to be. And if there is no sign of apology coming from that person, don't give him the satisfaction to continue to suffer from his offense. Forgive yourself for knowing him, rid your heart of all retaliatory vibration for it is what that keeps your pain alive, and move to the next page of your life.

And you will agree with me when I say ."There are offenses that leave a scar in your heart; there are offenses that leave a scar in your brain, and offenses that leave a scar on your body. Each of these different types of offenses requires different level of understanding and spiritual strength to forgive." (Paragraph 4 of the article)

Take heart, my friend, I wish you peace, comfort, and courage. Please, forgive, and you shall feel strong again. Thanks

  • 2 votes
#8.2 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 4:44 PM EDT
Dowser

SoCalGal, it is very hard to forgive in those cases... it took me a long time, but I finally was able to put that behind me.

It will soon be better and it will come eventually. I don't think that God wants us to forgive instantly-- sometimes, it takes awhile. :-)

(((((((((((SoCalGal)))))))))))))

  • 3 votes
#8.3 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 5:37 PM EDT
Truth be told-1349420

Very well said Dowser, very well said.
(By the way I nearly had a heart attack reading your "Smoke" article. Thanks for the suspense.)

  • 2 votes
#8.4 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 6:24 PM EDT
Dowser

Thanks for reading it! :-)

It was a day and a half, that one! :-)

  • 2 votes
#8.5 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 10:14 PM EDT
Hekofawoman

SoCAGal - you so are my twin....hmmmmm. I wish I could write better what I wish to say to you....I will surely try...but I have never been one to think about what I write or say...It must just come out that way it's meant too....so I can't do it right now. I hope it will come out for you. But, I do understand. Sometimes when I can't say what I want, it's usually cause it's pretty close to the heart, and that's still hard for me, but I'm getting better at it. Hek

  • 1 vote
#8.6 - Fri Jul 30, 2010 10:51 AM EDT
Reply
Truth be told-1349420

Thanks my beloved Hek for stopping by. I was wondering where you were. For quite a few days I had not met your fingerprint anywhere on the vine. Glad you're okay.


"I have never in my head or heart said to myself....I need to forgive them so I can feel better. What happened for me was "time" stepped in and took over."

That's my very point, dear, and you said it well. why do I have to be in hurry to forgive someone who intentionally decided to hurt me and then run to me for forgiveness so that he or she can escape the torture of guilt or critics while I may still be suffering from the damage of their offense. That is definitely, like you said, something that will inevitably happen with time. As time passes, your heart shall heal and your brain shall no longer think of it, and it is then and only then that one may recover his/her forgiving spirit. It could be a short time or a long time, depends how deep you were hurt. And when the time comes for you to forgive your offender, you want to protect yourself from further harm or abuse. If you are to go back to the friendship original state, time will make it happen provided that no other offenses take place during the process. Like I said, Forgiveness isn’t something you just shower someone with upon request, but which must be administered slowly and gradually like a medicine.; for an overdose can cause serious side effects.

When you have a friend that you care about, what hurts him/her, also hurts you. For this reason you give the best of your advices to protect them and yourself.
Thanks again for coming by my friend. Peace and love. Stay alerted.

  • 2 votes
Reply#9 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 10:11 AM EDT
Hekofawoman

Hi Truth - I'm doing well....been on a loooooong stretch at work, just finishing up my 10th shift outta 12, arggggg. I'll be off the weekend though, Thank God! On the matter of forgiving me, well.....I find it hard to forgive myself sometimes for not getting angry, for not being stronger, and for allowing certain things to control me. I still work on that daily...but, like everything it's a process and it's getting better. Thanks for your kind words always towards me, you are very appreciated in my life:) Hek

  • 2 votes
#9.1 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 10:25 PM EDT
Reply
Mighty Mouth

A lack of forgiveness in a philosophical sense, increases the karmic debt which may well be meted out on both sides - the stupid therefore, neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget - On the other hand, the wise forgives but never forgets.

To err is to be human - to forgive divine.

  • 5 votes
Reply#10 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 10:42 AM EDT
Truth be told-1349420

Oh MightyMouth, coming out of your Mouth, those words sound Mighty. Nothing is left to be added. I thank you so much for your participation. That's all I can say. Peace.

  • 3 votes
#10.1 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 4:50 PM EDT
Hekofawoman

Hi mightyj - I always like what you have to say....you break it down pretty simple. I don't know which of the 3 I am, but I'll say, I forgot about forgiving, then I remembered why I ever had too. Hek:)

  • 2 votes
#10.2 - Thu Jul 29, 2010 10:20 PM EDT
Mighty Mouth

Truth dear one, as ever - a beautiful and well-observed, deeply thought-provoking thread...

  • 2 votes
#10.3 - Fri Jul 30, 2010 1:24 PM EDT
Hekofawoman

Mighty M - he is but a "dear" one.

  • 2 votes
#10.4 - Fri Jul 30, 2010 7:10 PM EDT
Hekofawoman

Truth - if it were possible....this song is for you..........with all my heart;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-Lp2uC_1lg

In so many ways, you'll never know, all of this is true...........thank you my dear friend for your friendship and adoration:) (Just picture her blonde) You make me feel so beautiful inside and out:) Hek

  • 1 vote
#10.5 - Fri Jul 30, 2010 7:12 PM EDT
Hekofawoman

That sums up what my heart is capable of, and would do, for the one!!! You have inspired and sparked that "thing" inside of me to allow me to know it still exsists:)

  • 1 vote
#10.6 - Fri Jul 30, 2010 7:16 PM EDT
Truth be told-1349420

Thanks so much Hek for the song. You wouldn't imagine the effect this particular song has on me each time I hear it. It was this very song I danced to holding on my bribe hands while many were watching the night we got married. She has left my mind, but that moment was the sweetest memory of my life. I thank you for bringing it back although it brings a lump in my throat in lieu of tears. Thanks.

  • 1 vote
#10.7 - Fri Jul 30, 2010 9:44 PM EDT
Hekofawoman

I'm sorry about the choices, but even you must know there is a common denominator in all relatohsips...........I clouse them now, bit the rest got erased.............dammit. Truth, you must not inda gal cussing in private............lol Now I'm sure you have disgarded me...lol (please don't) all do. I always thought it was me who was always so scared, when really, it' the whole world..............Hek. just my thoughts again.

  • 1 vote
#10.8 - Fri Jul 30, 2010 10:47 PM EDT
Truth be told-1349420

Oh no. On the contrary, it amazes me to see you have chosen this particular song. I love it. It's all good. We certainly do have a spiritual connection as you've always said.

  • 1 vote
#10.9 - Sat Jul 31, 2010 1:03 AM EDT
Sandi Holland

I know there are some things we will not ever be able to forget, no matter how much we want to. It has nothing to do with forgiveness. If you have forgiven, don't be upset and distressed if you can not forget some things.

    #10.10 - Sat Jul 31, 2010 3:06 PM EDT
    Truth be told-1349420

    If you have forgiven, don't be upset and distressed if you can not forget some things.

    Excellent advise. Thanks.

    • 1 vote
    #10.11 - Sat Jul 31, 2010 3:56 PM EDT
    CL1

    Tuth be told --- nice opinion piece and worthy of thought. Imo, I didn't read anyone to address "trust." ..sorry if I missed it somewhere. ;) .. I could only forgive someone if I thought I could trust them in the future, otherwise the original problem will remain an issue. Of course, forgiveness is also relative to the crime that was committed, yes? Yet, large or small, in your own heart and mind, you must have faith and trust that they won't ever repeat the offense again, to forgive them.

    Also, I don't think forgiveness should be used to grant penitence. If all grievances can easily be forgiven, then folks would guiltlessly commit more crimes, imo.

    Thanks for the article.

      #10.12 - Sat Jul 31, 2010 8:23 PM EDT
      Reply
      Marc_Kh

      Truth, very interesting article, it was a pleasure to read your thoughts on the matter.

      However, I have always (well... adult life kind of thing), believed that forgiveness was internal. Whether it may bring comfort to the offender or not, for me is irrelevant, but feel free to put it in the equation.

      What matters most when you forgive, is YOUR ability to move on in your life. Forgiving is simply letting go. Learning....

      Let me put it this way... when we are kids, just toddlers, we explore the world around us... at one given point, we seem to fall hard on the floor or bump our head to the table!! at first we don't forgive the floor or the table for the pain they have caused... Forgiveness comes, when we learn to balance ourselves, when we are ready to start moving and not worry about the table, because now we can deal with it... (either because we can handle the pain, or because we can avoid it)...

      Forgiveness is for you and not the offender.... by forgiving, you are telling yourself:

      a- It's ok... the pain will fade

      b- This will not stop me from living

      c- It's safe to live

      When we get stuck in the past, however recent it may be, Living becomes somewhat of an impossibility...

      Cheers,

      • 3 votes
      Reply#11 - Fri Jul 30, 2010 2:20 AM EDT
      Truth be told-1349420

      I thank you, Mark_kh. You have spoken wisely and in a virile and substantial way. I so value your thought. Thanks for stopping by. Peace.

      • 3 votes
      #11.1 - Fri Jul 30, 2010 8:47 AM EDT
      SoCAGal

      Very well stated Mark_kh. Thank you for sharing your thoughts on this topic.

      • 2 votes
      #11.2 - Fri Jul 30, 2010 11:12 AM EDT
      Marc_Kh

      I love this community... and it seemed like the right place to start after a little absence... thank you both for taking the time!

      • 1 vote
      #11.3 - Sat Jul 31, 2010 3:17 AM EDT
      Reply
      Sandi Holland

      I like your article and your points were very well made. I find that cultivating a forgiving spirit so that I am quick to forgive relieves me of anger and bitterness. After I have forgiven in my heart, if necessary I let a person(s) know that I have forgiven them. It is then time for me to evaluate how to handle the association or relationship from that point.

      It is here that your points are so relevant for me. I do agree with you that it is foolish, and even dangerous, to place myself back into a situation in which someone continues to not mean me any good.

      • 1 vote
      Reply#12 - Sat Jul 31, 2010 2:57 PM EDT
      Truth be told-1349420

      Thanks a lot Sandi Holland for your participation. Yes, you have caught my point so intelligently. Thanks for your opinion and understanding. Peace

      • 2 votes
      Reply#13 - Sat Jul 31, 2010 3:53 PM EDT
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